Difficulty Rising


#237

Not a single person who invested in GPU’s at any time is at risk of losing their entire investment, unlike ASICs should an abrupt algorithm change occur. The difference is night and day.


#238

the difference is that asic is much less atractive as an investment.

i just can not see why zcash from asic-resistant should convert into asic-saving…


#239

Good and bad news for asic lovers are that bitmain having big trouble now…it has 300 million debt to chip manufacturer so it need cash badly or they will stop sending them chips …so they sell all asic From their mining facilities like that LTC and dash asics for 60$ even they dont sell better models …if they don’t get cash they want pay debt and want have chips for asic so difficulty will stop… because no new asic from bitman…on other hand they will do everything to collect as much cash as possible and zcash is now most profitable.


#240

It’s INCREDIBLY hard for me to believe that Bitmain’s having trouble coming up with $300M.

You trust “anonymous sources?” In 2018? From a crypto news site?


#241

#242

How is this different compared to GPUs in May-June, right before ASICs came out. If you turn everything you just said about ASICs into GPUs, how can you say ASICs deserve different treatment now?

Zooko is looking out for the entire community in regards to gradual changes. He’s aware that ASICs forcing out GPU miners will disproportionately hurt the endusers who purchased GPUs, such as the people who bought your friend’s GPUs. The manufacturers won’t be hurt as badly, since they’ve already made a profit on the units they manufactured. I’m all for PoW changes, but abruptly allowing ASICs would hurt a lot of people and more than likely fracture the community.

Its was ok months ago when ZCash the ASIC-RESISTANT coin accepted ASICs, making GPUs obsolete. But now the ASIC users think PoW changes that might make their hardware obsolete “would hurt a lot of people and more than likely fracture the community”.

This is the risk you take when you buy a ASIC, this is why I say again and again GPUs are better, there is many more reasons to purchase a GPU vs a ASIC. All ASICs have going for it is speed, it does this at the cost of everything else, and its not worth it.

I am not guaranteed my graphics card will resell, it is much more likely than a used ASIC I will agree. However people purchasing GPUs nowdays have the risk of no safe GPU coin. If coins keep letting ASICs on, soon GPUs will have no profitable coins left to mine, making our investments lose much of the value as everyone sells thousands of GPUs on the market crashing the price.


#243

I find it very hard to belive they are having problems paying bills judging on how much everyone said they made last year alone.

And many many more articles on how they made BILLIONS in PROFITS, not revenue. But some how they are in financial trouble because they still owe millions? If they go bankrupt, clearly there is corruption and money was siphoned away instead of paying off debts aka stealing.


#244

that is from february…now is november …in january i was profiting 120$ a day now my profit is 2-3$ a day


#245

Ok? Feb or Nov does it matter? How does this change the billions on profits they made last year in the past?

Could they have more expenses from this year, sure I agree. That does not make billions in profits from last year just dissapear. I dont see why they would need a billion dollar loan they cant pay back, considering they made billions just a year before…

Could it be true, sure…From what I have seen so far, I have my doubts.


#246

Yup. This is the article I was talking about that cites anonymous sources “close to Bitmain.”

Credibility = Zero


#247

There are similarities, definitely. I suppose the major difference is that GPUs weren’t “bricked” when Zcash chose not to fork. My GPUs are still making money, and there are several other options for GPU miners. Maybe it shouldn’t matter, but the risk of loss isn’t comparable.


#248

Once again, I can change the word GPU to ASIC and its still just as relevant.

There are similarities, definitely. I suppose the major difference is that ASICs won’t be “bricked” when ZCash choses to fork. My ASICs will still make money, and there are several other options for ASIC miners. Maybe it shouldn’t matter, but the risk of loss isn’t comparable.

ZCash is not the only Equihash coin. Just because the most profitable coin gets removed, doesnt mean your hardware is “bricked”. The GPU miners were pushed out of all the Equihash coins, most were the most profitable at the time, why should ASICs get special treatment now?


#249

That’s where we’ll have to agree to disagree. There’s no realistic economical alternative for Equihash ASICs. Even if ZEN or some other coin is still ASIC mineable, it wouldn’t be economical. There are several alternatives for GPUs that are economical. To suggest that there are economical alternatives for Equihash ASICs in the same way that there are economical alternatives for GPUs is silly.


#250

True, but GPU rigs cost a lost more. I spent 3x as much on GPU rigs and only make half as much as the Z9’s.


#251

How does ZCash changing its PoW “brick” ASICs. It would force the ASIC to go mine a less profitable coin, just like ASICs did to the GPU miners. I never said its economical, or the same as GPUs, I was pointing out the fact ASICs would not be “bricked” like you are claiming, only forced off the network.

Why take such a risk to invest into ASICs knowing a small change can leave you with no economical alternatives, it almost seems like gambling at this point.


#252

You can mine other equicash coins…this coin was promoted everywhere as ASIC resistant and decentralised coin and now is ASIC savor because all ASIC lower are now on Zcash because all other ASICs are now unprofitable .But is different thread .But truth is that GPUs on Zcash are bricked and now mine other equicash and that is BTG


#253

Actually now most profitable ASIC is on Siacoin as they forked to brick Bitmain’s ASICs :smiley:


#254

Actually it indeed could (not saying it is!) true that they have financial problems. Sure, they made a huge profit last year, but Q2 and Q3 2018 are allready big loses if i remember right. Beside that they invested a lot into new facilities outside China and that’s an expensive task for sure. No matter if Bitmain makes monthly profit or lose they have a lot of monthly expenses to pay as well, for example the ~1.800 engineers working there.
Eventually big part of the pie from last year went to investors for paying back and dividends.

I’am 50/50 on believing it’s true.


#255

Maybe this one makes a bit more sense as a lot of investments Bitmain made the last months are explained. It could be possible that these expenses have eaten allready last years net profit and that Bitmain itself calculated wrong and thought they will continue with an increasing net profit while they face now a big negative balance in Q2/Q3 and almost certain in Q4 as well.


#256

You say they might be in financial troubles, then you link a article that shows how well they have been doing last year and this year. It then goes on to say how they have almost a 80% monopoly on the market and are making billions this year.

Again with a massively profitable year of 2017 with a net profit of $1.2 billion, Bitmain has been aggressively investing in tech startups to expand its portfolio & solidify its position in the Crypto industry. According to insider sources Bitmain has already earned a profit of $1 billion in the first quarter of 2018 with an expected profited of $2–3 billion for the full year. With a solid balance sheet like this the company has invested in the following ventures

these are billions in PROFITS, the money you have left over AFTER all the expenses. To go from making billions to bankrupt in a few months, someone must of fu**ked up baaaad.

Finally, CEO Jihan Wu is planning to launch an IPO (Initial Public Offering) for Bitmain for $14 billion to raise capital for further expansion, R&D and also giving the early adopters of the company a chance to cash out their profits.

Does not sound like they are in trouble to me, considering they might have close to 14 billion comming in soon…

They made billions last year, have made a billion or two this year, and invested 500-750 million…im not the best at math, but it seems like they should have a few dollars left over…