So I had a videochat with Jihan Wu


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Thx for sharing!,keep up the good work!

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I see a man of culture - i upvote

P.S. Another nail in the GPU-mining coffin

Nice read and thx for sharing. It was interesting due several reasons.

First of all giving some insight. Second, rarely someone has a chance to ask directly questions and get direct and (hopefully) honest answers. Third, for your transparency in this case and sharing it with us. Pretty sure many others wouldn’t bother to make notices and share with the community.

To comment some of the issues:

I take the argument with the communication issue. Even me as an european had some issues in the past. About 25 years back i had business relations mostly with US partners. To say it softly, communication was a problem, not due the language but because every discussion ending with “We US are most democratic, most advanced, most everything, what do you know”, cutting you off directly without any chance.

With china there is as well a problem. For example i try to purchase still some Baikals, impossible. We are running in a circle for 6 weeks now. I tell them send me the total amount and bank info and they send back what do you want to buy, no matter i listed it allready. Communication problems at it’s best.

About the stealth mining, you should have him asked when they test with how many units they test. I’am 50/50 on this issue to be honest. On one side i would understand them that currently it is dangerous to reveal a miner and than having maybe the majority of the coins forking away putting even the own mining operations at risk and of course the sales. On the other hand, mining isn’t their priority income, so i would make sense that they have not much need of stealth mining at all.

I actually believe with the monero story due different facts. First, the Antminer was the last one released on cryptonite. Baikal was the first and must have most of them online. Having in mind until some days baikal sold the cryptonite miner for pay 1, get 5, suggests that they have most units. No garantee of course, but it would indeed make sense.

However, i doubt it will change much, even in our community here. Allready to many hardliner rumour believers that prevour 3rd hand information instead of 1st hand information.


Why didn’t you as well post the tweet this was directed to?

Well. Some of us give two fucks about your 2MB hardfork.

At least everybody can see the context why he answered like that, not that it was the best way for a CEO, no doubt here.

I feel ashamed.

Bitmain has the right to keep private his operations, revenue, shareholders and future releases.

This is a shame because you are using him as a punching bag, you are authoritarian against him and you feel powerful enough to ask those questions whereas you don’t dare to do that to Nvidia nor extort them to release future plans, revenues and private operations of what they do. You don’t even dare to meet with the CEO and ask those unrespectful questions because you know you won’t get attended nor answered.

This is the Bitmain witch hunt.

This guy has more skin in the game than Nvidia and all of you combined. He has a lot to lose if Zcash fails unlike Nvidia yet you still bully him. For that reason he is probably scared of your authoritarian power but in my opinion he shouldn’t have answered any of your questions. You own the brand and have the connections with the exchanges, he knows as for now you have an absolute power over ZCash.

You said you are annoyed for the fact that he didn’t let you know he was releasing a product, really, ask yourself who are you? you don’t have any right to know that.

It’s a shame you always refer to a supposedly “community” yet you don’t include Bitmain. Who’s the community? I wonder…

This is a shame, a violation on the presumption of innocence and an attack of the freedom of enterprise.


OMG - did he say something mean on the internet. unsure the world will ever recover from this.


asking questions is authoritative? okay… lol… hope zooko didn’t hurt bitmain’s feels.


w00t !! top notch shilling action right there! i’m proud!


lol…nVidia and AMD are publicly traded companies subject to the rules and regulations of the SEC. You can go get all that as a matter of public record from both of them. Anything else they wouldn’t disclose is because they have a duty to their share holders to not do so until the appropriate time. However, you can safely assume that because of rules regarding publicly traded companies, the information they withhold is still above-board.

Bitmain isn’t subject to ANY of those same rules. Most of what they choose to share would be voluntary and there isn’t any repercussions for misleading (or outright false) information.

This is much like all the FUD about the S11 ASIC miner. They publicly stated that they have not offered an “S11 miner” and that they haven’t made any public statement about one yet. However, at no point do they actually say “it doesn’t exist” only that any attempt to sell one is fraudulent.


Nice to see Bitmain opening up and be transparent, evenso, they don’t have to do so …

so …77 x 10 ksols shipped from 27 may …let’s see what this does in terms of difficulty, and what coins … My gues…won’t do a much on Zcash …

Come on, don’t say you believed him. So Jihan wanted to convince you that 80% of Monero hashrate (which was 400 thousand Vega 64’s or 1 million RX 570/580s at the time) mining solo was just some other miner? I don’t think that miner would have just missed V7 hard fork, that was ASICs for sure, since hashrate fell 6x after the fork. And first batch of X3’s was set to deliver in May. I don’t think you can’t connect the dots, it’s so obvious.

[Moderation edit by @daira for a matter of factual accuracy: the Monero hash rate did not fall by 6x after their PoW fork. It fell substantially, but not by 6 times.]


Wait … A guy holding a quarter of a 10B$ company is not aware of such a huge deal ?!? “I don’t know” means something else here… Maybe something like “oh man, don’t ask me this…”

There is a good book about culture differences in business… I’d recommend it here…

Edit: this post is meant to continue on zooko’s quote. Not specifically targeting your comment, kek.

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might not be wise for him to publicly comment on this, yet.

Sure, but then this transcript is a source of noise …

imo, he acknowledged it without comment.

Pathetic. Really Pathetic!

Jihan Wu is playing you, and he is playing everyone in the community. Just think about the questions that SHOULD HAVE BEEN ASKED!

You don’t just ask questions, you tell him what the questions should be. Do the MATH! It’s all about supply and demand. You didn’t ask anything that is related to long term Supply Chain Strategy.

Bitmain has locked in Suppliers and has virtually eliminated competition. They OWN YOU ZCASH! Your just too ignorant to realize it. This weak interview is a perfect example of weak negotiations that will lead to the end of Centralized Mining with (Reasonable) profits for the community.

It’s not just about BITMAIN mining in secret it’s the BIG PICTURE! Bitmain has locked in Suppliers and their Business Strategy is to STOP people from mining at home.

Step 1: Drive the PR Campaign to make BITMAIN look like a transparent Company.
Step 2: Eliminate GPU Mining (In process, with Equihash and ETHASH)
Step 3: Procure all the Long Lead Time items so that nobody else can get supply to Build ASICS. (Already done to SIA)
Step 4: Flood the entire industry with BITMAIN ASIC Miners, in order to raise difficulty so high that electricity stops individuals from mining, then moving the remaining GPU miners to ASIC, and specifically BITMAIN, because of the highest hash rate/price ratio.
Step 5: (In-Process) Build Mining Farms in the lowest electric locations in the world. In the USA (Washington) to secure the $.03/rate.
Step 6: Price Manipulation (Ongoing) After securing a majority of the world mining hardware sold to the public, price manipulation of miners becomes much easier, after the entire Supply Chain is now controlled by Bitmain. Bitmain can now bleed off sales to individuals as their profits trend down to the cost of electricity. During the 18month Cycle new R&D is preparing to release a new BITMAIN Antminer to begin steps 1-6 all over again.

This formula works, and it’s been working for BITMAIN. Does anyone honestly believe that BITMAIN cares about the Community? Developers have been taking a political role and they will get in bed with what they perceive is best. Again, what the perceive is best. Logic will dictate that working directly with a Company that has a history of hiding it’s Agenda is NOT a Business anyone should be doing Business with. However the folks at Bitmain, are incredibly smart and cunning. They will exploit you, take advantage of you, and before it’s all over, they will make you think that you are doing the right thing, by working with them. This is the Culture that will eventually take over the Blockchain.

It must be stopped! My fellow community, we CANNOT ALLOW Bitmain to take over the entire Cryptocurrency Blockchain. It will become Centralized, by just one organization, BITMAIN, if you do not stop them.

To Zooko:
How can we really trust your intentions? Are you too naive to lead? Are you now in bed with Bitmain? Are you now just a politician? You need to put Pressure on Bitmain! LEAD, don’t FOLLOW behind!



Thats a perfect example that people believe whatever they want to believe.

In this case that Bitmains X3 have been on the net, no matter that Baikal and Innosilicon way sooner announced their cryptonite miners. Doesn’t matter, whatever, the hardliner defender just know what they want to know, not even thinking about other more logical possibilities.

Ah, the good ol’ “I only see what I want to see” behavior.

Very unconstructive.


That is amazing crypto-community progress Zooko. Thank you!