Zcash Proof of Stake Megathread 🧵

This is a fascinating megathread with many interesting analyses and deep experience. For the knowledgeable miners here, do you ever foresee the case where hardware becomes more and more expensive but also more and more efficient, requiring less energy? Is there a limit where you are, in effect, paying almost exclusively for hardware and less for operating costs? If so, this is the limit where buying hardware may perhaps be a pure proxy for buying coins with the exception that the hardware could generate more coins over time and help pay for itself and earn profit. If so, this is the limit where PoW becomes the same as PoS in economic terms. I wonder if this will ever happen?

Also, in terms of anonymous ways to actually buy Zcash, and mining being one such way of disassociating your on-ramp to Zcash from your identity, do you think something like thorchain or another way to go between chains in a robust manner would alleviate this problem?

2 Likes

All that you wrote is trends. In the end, it will happen that way.

3 Likes

More evidence with a disposition against the climate alarmism. The Ex-President of Greenpeace exposes the secrets of the politically motiviated climate claims made in policy set forth by the Paris Accord.

“The Scientists are hiding behind the politicians, because that is who funds them” - Patrick Moore Co-Founder & Ex-President of Greenpeace

“They are not scientists claiming there is a climate emergency, they are political activists… They are really really stupid and bad” - Patrick Moore Co-Founder & Ex-President of Greenpeace when asked about Extinction Rebellion

How would something like this impact our plans to move towards POS?

Ignoring the climate argument, good PoS design is multiple times more accessible to the masses than PoW with centralized production (easily seized by nation states) of specialized hardware (with clear advantage for the rich few).

6 Likes
4 Likes

Do you have any details how pos would work in zec ?
like what i need to do for staking ?
(minimal number of coins for minting\nodes or master nodes support\ etc)

or any ETA for this ?

no minimum stake. you will use wallet on tor browser or zecwallet fullnode. everyone in this world who using tor browser can stake zcash. 21 million of zcash stake in this world. imagine the price should be.

1 Like

Welcome to the forums @isxaker , the details as far as timeline are in the blog. As far as the specifics for staking and validators, it’s still being worked out.

4 Likes

Wait, what?

Ziga brings up a very good point. If ZEC switched to PoS in 3 years, that’s well before 21M coins will have been mined…?

How does emission/distribution work after the switch to reach 21M? :thinking::thinking:

4 Likes

I believe the network and token dynamics need to be worked out following the launch of Halo 2.
I’m particularly interested in the minimum ZEC required to run staking nodes/validators, the minimum ZEC required to earn rewards in wallets and the % rewards & time-frame of emission curve from the beginning of hybrid-POS to full PoS when all 21M ZEC are issued.

6 Likes

I’ve been wondering the same thing ever since ECC releases the brand new roadmap. Zcash has a social consensus/expectation that the number of ZEC will be capped at 21M. However, there are questions of the viability of such plan (capped emission) and it has nothing to do with PoW/PoS, Bitcoin will have the same problem in the relatively far future.

There is perhaps an ideal future where we will have billions of daily transactions on Zcash and transaction fees would suffice as reward for PoS validators. The biggest problem I would see here is that the reward will be very unstable which would compromise the security.

3 Likes

Whatever the distribution rules, I assume that the current emission curve would be preserved, and thus the current halving schedule would be preserved too.

5 Likes

I wouldn’t assume the same. There is an expectation about 21m ZEC cap but not specific emission curve. Halving on PoS is unheard of (cmiiw). If anything, the number of new ZEC emission should depends on number of ZEC staked.

2 Likes

Otherwise, it implies a loss of confidence in the decentralization of the coin.

2 Likes

Europe considering to ban mining. Happy to hear about pos for zcash.

2 Likes