# ZIP - Changing Zcash supply curve to 3% yearly after 2020 halving **URL:** \ **Category:** protocol\ **Created:** [September 4, 2019, 8:02pm UTC](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/t/zip-changing-zcash-supply-curve-to-3-yearly-after-2020-halving/34894 "2019-09-04T20:02:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![kek](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/user_avatar/forum.zcashcommunity.com/kek/32/17068_2.png) [@kek](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/u/kek)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 7:28pm UTC](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/t/zip-changing-zcash-supply-curve-to-3-yearly-after-2020-halving/34894/21 "2019-09-06T19:28:23Z")
okay, guess that was poor example. we need lower inflation to match the markets. we will not perform well against alts with much lower inflation. ZEC market performance has been amongst the worst, and even after halving we’ll still be getting crushed. [https://beincrypto.com/5-major-altcoins-most-bagholders/](https://beincrypto.com/5-major-altcoins-most-bagholders/) things need to change. high inflation is literally a form of self harm. ---
**Author:** ![tromer](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/user_avatar/forum.zcashcommunity.com/tromer/32/14860_2.png) [@tromer](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/u/tromer)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 7:33pm UTC](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/t/zip-changing-zcash-supply-curve-to-3-yearly-after-2020-halving/34894/22 "2019-09-06T19:33:42Z")
@kek, you’re assuming that the relative market performance is mostly due to inflation. Can you support this assumption? There are many other hypotheses, some leading to an opposite conclusion. ---
**Author:** ![kek](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/user_avatar/forum.zcashcommunity.com/kek/32/17068_2.png) [@kek](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/u/kek)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 7:34pm UTC](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/t/zip-changing-zcash-supply-curve-to-3-yearly-after-2020-halving/34894/23 "2019-09-06T19:34:53Z")
can you point me in the direction of a highly inflationary currency that performs really well? ![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/original/2X/c/ca34b0d064dbed6e10931909575a2cf123e33254.jpeg) ![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/original/2X/9/99499548893efe53b12c0d6e73e60522d63ff240.jpeg) ![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/original/2X/7/75aff579da52d944e5a89f37edcd6931511d43f2.jpeg) ![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/original/2X/a/a32e74b884bd19ac5a2b3865690141d6fc84fec2.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![tromer](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/user_avatar/forum.zcashcommunity.com/tromer/32/14860_2.png) [@tromer](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/u/tromer)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 7:40pm UTC](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/t/zip-changing-zcash-supply-curve-to-3-yearly-after-2020-halving/34894/24 "2019-09-06T19:40:58Z")
Of course: Bitcoin. Zcash uses exactly the same inflation curve as Bitcoin (except for the slow start). ---
**Author:** ![kek](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/user_avatar/forum.zcashcommunity.com/kek/32/17068_2.png) [@kek](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/u/kek)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 7:42pm UTC](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/t/zip-changing-zcash-supply-curve-to-3-yearly-after-2020-halving/34894/25 "2019-09-06T19:42:46Z")
imo, bitcoin is a poor example. BTC had no competition for a long duration. still really has no competition. we’re trying to attract people. today’s world, high inflation (rightly) scares people off. there’s 1000s of alts to choose from. ---
**Author:** ![boxalex](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/user_avatar/forum.zcashcommunity.com/boxalex/32/14872_2.png) [@boxalex](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/u/boxalex)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 7:54pm UTC](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/t/zip-changing-zcash-supply-curve-to-3-yearly-after-2020-halving/34894/26 "2019-09-06T19:54:14Z")
> [@tromer](#): > > @kek, you’re assuming that the relative market performance is mostly due to inflation. Can you support this assumption? There are many other hypotheses, some leading to an opposite conclusion. I doubt that there is an opposite conclusion possible that the market performance is positive due that high inflation rate. I made for the last year x calculations versus Bitcoin and the main factor on these is the inflation rate of ZEC and i several times have predicted the price levels that ZEC versus BTC will reach. While this is of course no proof it’s at least an argument that the inflation plays a huge role, even i agree it’s not the only one. But actually it’s simple mathematics, especially versus BTC. It’s a vicious circle we are in. - There since the bear winter no incentive to hold ZEC as it’s clear that it will fall further. - It’s obvious that there is more supply than demand. Don’t be fooled by the fake volume a lot of exchanges report and even this is not really a demand. - The only thing that could counter the current inflation would be creating at least the same or more demand, obviously you guys struggle with that and it’s mission impossible the next years as it seems. > [@tromer](#): > > Of course: Bitcoin. Zcash uses exactly the same inflation curve as Bitcoin Actually that’s the biggest flaw of Zcash. I wonder why no economist analysed this in 2016. Actually it’s exactly BTC and the same inflation rate of BTC that ZEC has that got us into the vicious circle: With our high inflation we have to competete, yes, we compete against BTC because it’s a fight for investors. There is no incentive to hold ZEC if it losses daily to it’s totally wrong choosen copy pasted BTC inflation rate. BTC sucks all up and makes BTC even stronger day by day making many Alt’s including ZEC lossing more and more. I could write some more pages but nobody would read it than again. What amazes me are the following things: - Why didn’t an economist analyse the supply curve prior to ZEC release. But ok, done is done. - The inflation rate hurts not only investors, actually it hurts the 20% founders reward and will hurt the a possible 20% new dev fund. I find it amazing that even such proposals or suggestions like this aren’t even considered, researched, whatever. - By now 3 years have past with this rediclious high inflation rate. Don’t you guys/girls at least analyse things why we find ourself that low price wise? Sure, there are some minor other issues as well, but that’s just the main reason combined with the of course low demand. If you can’t help increase demand, lower supply, there is just no other option for the next years, easy and simple as that. - Just out of curiousity. If the ECC gets a new, let’s say 10% dev fund (for both ECC/ZF) and the price falls down to $25 (absolutly possible!) or even at a lower price level around $15 which is more unlikely but still possible. Are you still that relaxed at these levels? ---
**Author:** ![kek](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/user_avatar/forum.zcashcommunity.com/kek/32/17068_2.png) [@kek](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/u/kek)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 8:01pm UTC](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/t/zip-changing-zcash-supply-curve-to-3-yearly-after-2020-halving/34894/27 "2019-09-06T20:01:52Z")
> [@boxalex](#): > > Why didn’t an economist analyse the supply curve prior to ZEC release. But ok, done is done always been frustrated with this. built really cool technology, but copy/pasted bitcoin’s economic engine. ---
**Author:** ![kek](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/user_avatar/forum.zcashcommunity.com/kek/32/17068_2.png) [@kek](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/u/kek)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 8:08pm UTC](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/t/zip-changing-zcash-supply-curve-to-3-yearly-after-2020-halving/34894/28 "2019-09-06T20:08:15Z")
here’s another coin with gross inflation @tromer do you notice anything on this grin chart has in common with zcash ![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/original/2X/c/cd44318e7295e091cbe7f2e94ada90a8f3a8c129.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![boxalex](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/user_avatar/forum.zcashcommunity.com/boxalex/32/14872_2.png) [@boxalex](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/u/boxalex)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 8:18pm UTC](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/t/zip-changing-zcash-supply-curve-to-3-yearly-after-2020-halving/34894/29 "2019-09-06T20:18:29Z")
Some good resource concerning the inflation rates of some Alts and conclusions of the influence of Inflation: Some interesting parts: > However, a high inflation doesn’t matter so much, **if there is a high demand**. Bitcoin had a very high inflation rate of 208% in 2010 and 59% in 2011, but managed to go up from being basically worthless to 30 US Dollars in mid-2011. The Binance coin has also performed very well in 2018, even though 32% more coins were put into circulation in 2018, than there were in 2017. It has to be stated though, that most cryptocurrencies **don’t have a very high demand** and are just speculation objects, **which leads to prices massively decreasing** if a **bigger amount of yet undistributed coins and tokens hits the market.** > Wrap-up > > Inflation of the circulating supply is a factor, that can have a fundamental influence to the price, even though it is not often considered in a price analysis. ==\> One of the reasons i use the inflation rate in my calculations and don’t use blind the technical indicators only. > **[Cryptocurrency Inflation Rates - Christian Ott](https://christianott.co/inflationrates_en/)** > > The article displays the inflation rates of CoinMarketCap's top 20 cryptocurrencies over time and also discusses supply inflation in general. ---
**Author:** ![boxalex](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/user_avatar/forum.zcashcommunity.com/boxalex/32/14872_2.png) [@boxalex](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/u/boxalex)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2019, 8:28pm UTC](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/t/zip-changing-zcash-supply-curve-to-3-yearly-after-2020-halving/34894/30 "2019-09-06T20:28:04Z")
I will analyse some of these when i have more time next week might be interesting to see how some fixed currencies perform in generally: ![Inflation_Live](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/original/2X/d/dd47dace211e6995c15361af6155eb7d1fa6a27b.jpeg) ![Inflation_Fixed](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/original/2X/a/aad1f6541854a8d4e0ee9209016f691d1984a708.jpeg) [https://www.viewbase.com/blog/inflation-the-real-reason-behind-the-big-crash-of-zec-neo-and-others](https://www.viewbase.com/blog/inflation-the-real-reason-behind-the-big-crash-of-zec-neo-and-others) > Based on our [Inflation Tracker](https://www.viewbase.com/inflation), however, some cryptocurrencies have an inflation far worse than most fiat currencies. The worst offender is Zcash (ZEC) with a shocking **annualized inflation rate of ~42%** , which implies that its circulating supply increases by 42% annually ---
**Author:** ![kek](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/user_avatar/forum.zcashcommunity.com/kek/32/17068_2.png) [@kek](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/u/kek)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2019, 12:06am UTC](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/t/zip-changing-zcash-supply-curve-to-3-yearly-after-2020-halving/34894/31 "2019-09-07T00:06:48Z")
@johnwisdom @aeonglacial @phakov @root what do you guys think about this ZIP? ---
**Author:** ![aeonglacial](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/user_avatar/forum.zcashcommunity.com/aeonglacial/32/26643_2.png) [@aeonglacial](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/u/aeonglacial)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2019, 12:38am UTC](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/t/zip-changing-zcash-supply-curve-to-3-yearly-after-2020-halving/34894/32 "2019-09-07T00:38:30Z")
I respectfully withdraw my opinion from this topic because I am not too knowledgeable about cryptocurrency inflation or even the economics. We haven’t even come out of the womb in terms of actual decentralized services; paying rent by the second, streaming media etc(the many promises of the new crypto economy)…this is all sorta still sci-fy in my opinion. Perhaps we’re are over looking Satoshi’s genius in the inflation rate. Perhaps there’s something he/she/it knows that we don’t. ---
**Author:** ![boxalex](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/user_avatar/forum.zcashcommunity.com/boxalex/32/14872_2.png) [@boxalex](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/u/boxalex)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2019, 6:37am UTC](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/t/zip-changing-zcash-supply-curve-to-3-yearly-after-2020-halving/34894/33 "2019-09-07T06:37:34Z")
> [@aeonglacial](#): > > Perhaps we’re are over looking Satoshi’s genius in the inflation rate. Sastoshis inflation rate was perfectly choosen for Bitcoin and only for Bitcoin as the only crypto currency, i doubt he had in mind Zcash when he designed the inflation rate. That’s the problem with copy/paste parts, that they often don’t work out like on the original invention. ---
**Author:** ![boxalex](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/user_avatar/forum.zcashcommunity.com/boxalex/32/14872_2.png) [@boxalex](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/u/boxalex)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2019, 2:52pm UTC](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/t/zip-changing-zcash-supply-curve-to-3-yearly-after-2020-halving/34894/35 "2019-09-07T14:52:40Z")
> [@SexDrugsAndZcash](#): > > only to manipulate the price of ZEC?? > [@SexDrugsAndZcash](#): > > we should never question it especially not for price manipulation. This proposal is not manipulating the price, it’s a supply curve change, quiet different. > [@SexDrugsAndZcash](#): > > Satoshis inflation rate was perfectly chosen to make organic demand growing. I agree, it was perfectly choosen for Bitcoin. Did he ever mention that it should be used in Zcash too? If you think that everything Sastoshi related is perfect the best would be just to stick with BTC. > [@SexDrugsAndZcash](#): > > Leave the inflation rate untouched. No problem for me either. I don’t hold ZEC exactly for that reason. If everybody is fine that the price decrease (especially versus BTC) continues some more 4-5 years, so it be. > [@SexDrugsAndZcash](#): > > zcash worked hard enough to get regulatory compliance I fail to see how this one has anything to do with regulatory compliance, but ok, if you think it has, again, so it be 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![kek](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/user_avatar/forum.zcashcommunity.com/kek/32/17068_2.png) [@kek](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/u/kek)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2019, 2:54pm UTC](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/t/zip-changing-zcash-supply-curve-to-3-yearly-after-2020-halving/34894/36 "2019-09-07T14:54:01Z")
disagree with just about everything you just said here. thanks for your input, and welcome to the forum. ---
**Author:** ![kek](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/user_avatar/forum.zcashcommunity.com/kek/32/17068_2.png) [@kek](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/u/kek)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2019, 3:13pm UTC](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/t/zip-changing-zcash-supply-curve-to-3-yearly-after-2020-halving/34894/37 "2019-09-07T15:13:26Z")
**Raised objections and issues so far:** still looking to add to this part of the ZIP, but “satoshi is perfect” doesn’t really seem like a good one. > [@tromer](#): > > the monetary policy is an entrenched part of of the market expectations / social contract, and it’s best to minimize disruption of these unless there are very good reasons this one might be more valid, might add it, but we’re (most likely) already changing the monetary policy to continue devfund. ---
**Author:** ![kek](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/user_avatar/forum.zcashcommunity.com/kek/32/17068_2.png) [@kek](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/u/kek)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2019, 3:18pm UTC](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/t/zip-changing-zcash-supply-curve-to-3-yearly-after-2020-halving/34894/39 "2019-09-07T15:18:50Z")
> [@SexDrugsAndZcash](#): > > regulatory compliance? i’m not sure why you believe changing supply curve would matter to regulators. if changing supply curve was an issue with regulators - imagine they would’ve spoke-up about zcash slow mining start. ---
**Author:** ![kek](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/user_avatar/forum.zcashcommunity.com/kek/32/17068_2.png) [@kek](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/u/kek)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2019, 3:30pm UTC](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/t/zip-changing-zcash-supply-curve-to-3-yearly-after-2020-halving/34894/41 "2019-09-07T15:30:55Z")
> [@SexDrugsAndZcash](#): > > so changing the supply curve will be good for this group of people will be good for the entire network. the fact you know it will be good is very telling. > [@SexDrugsAndZcash](#): > > can you find one legit reason to change it if regulatory department of NY asks you about that not really, i’m more concerned with ridding zcash network of gross inflation, than appeasing some nobodies in a state i’ll never visit, for any reason. ---
**Author:** ![kek](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/user_avatar/forum.zcashcommunity.com/kek/32/17068_2.png) [@kek](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/u/kek)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2019, 4:07pm UTC](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/t/zip-changing-zcash-supply-curve-to-3-yearly-after-2020-halving/34894/43 "2019-09-07T16:07:52Z")
here’s the way i honestly look at this: zooko stated, and i completely agree (off top of head) “next 5-10 years most serious projects will have some privacy protections for users” this means we need to look for other ways to stand out from the very large crowd. one of the next things people might look at is inflation. smart people will head towards the highly fungible currencies with low inflation. inflation is okay as-long-as competition’s inflation is higher. imo, next 2 years are super important. > [@SexDrugsAndZcash](#): > > ok, lets agree to disagree 🙂 > i just have the opinion that mostly Zcash is great and some things should not be changed ever. : ) agree, and thank you, i appreciate when people make me think. ---
**Author:** ![boxalex](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/zcash/user_avatar/forum.zcashcommunity.com/boxalex/32/14872_2.png) [@boxalex](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/u/boxalex)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2019, 4:21pm UTC](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/t/zip-changing-zcash-supply-curve-to-3-yearly-after-2020-halving/34894/44 "2019-09-07T16:21:36Z")
> [@SexDrugsAndZcash](#): > > the intentions behind it are. i read the comments and i dont see any reason for the proposal, other than making ZEC price go up. Actually i see it different and not making the price going up but not falling deeper due the ridicilous high inflation rate. I guess it’s a question of point of view. > [@SexDrugsAndZcash](#): > > privacy coin changes the supply curve to 3% after half of the coins were mined in a much bigger curve has nothing to do with regulatory compliance? I agree that it’s far from ideal, it might be even an issue maybe which should or must be checked against any possible issue coming from that end. However, don’t be worried, as i know the foundation and ECC changing the supply curve isn’t going to happen anyway, so not much to argue here anymore anyay 🙂 [Previous page](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/t/zip-changing-zcash-supply-curve-to-3-yearly-after-2020-halving/34894.md?page=1) [Next page](https://forum.zcashcommunity.com/t/zip-changing-zcash-supply-curve-to-3-yearly-after-2020-halving/34894.md?page=3)