Proposal for a Zcash Governance Bloc (“zBloc”)

Hello!

The question is very complicated and I don’t have a clear concept, realizing that any of them will have flaws and it will be probably a compromise solution. And it will be a solution with certain technical barriers. But let’s try to think in that direction.

Preface. My first premise is that any system, as it grows, can have different best governance options. And the initial best option may be fundamentally different from subsequent, also best options.

Just even based on fundamental factors - different distribution of coins, different range of participants involved, different positions of the project in the regulatory environment, market outlook, competition and so on. The project in a certain initial stage needed coordinated decisions, in the current stage it has grown and needs more decentralized management. Especially when there are more and more people in the community with experience, not only in cryptocurrencies, but also in project management.

By the way, I would like to point out that Zcash today is one of the few projects whose management is practically devoid of the people who started the network. Our respected Andrew Miller is the only person who was there from the very beginning and today is on the board of ZF, but he modestly participates in the management just like any other member of the community. I haven’t even seen any of his public posts with his views on how decisions should be made in Zcash. It’s just a fact, I don’t want to color it in any way, but it highlights the power and decentralization of Zcash. And this is one of the main criteria for me of the importance of Zcash as an independent phenomenon.

What I like in ZCAP is the technical expertise of a fairly wide range of participants, because somehow people in ZCAP are much more involved in the technical side of Zcash than investors.

I’m an investor myself and I have a lot of respect for all investors. I totally disagree with the engineers and developers position that investors should be less involved in the management process. Because often, or even as a rule, without proper experience, management skills and market sense, people do not become investors. In addition, investors in Zcash, in my opinion, have exceptional foresight and strategic thinking. Therefore, what I don’t like about ZCAP is that ZCAP in its current form does not take into account the opinions of investors unless they have direct contact with ZCAP participants.

I also get angry when someone expresses the opinion that: “Zcash is a purely social product for the benefit of society. Why should we even care about speculation?” No way! Zcash is a symbiosis of both. This is crowdfunding for a Social product. In the end, it will not be able to exist if the price does not rise along with the value. This is not a contradiction! These are inextricably linked things - a single entity. It is so unified that it is impossible to determine what is primary here, since the technology itself is money.

However, without taking into account the views of the technical community, the governance processes will also reach an inevitable dead end. This is not some kind of assumption. It has been proven by decades of corporate governance practice. The best governance model for technical products is a bicameral system in which the technical community, guided by the interests of investors, offers the best solutions.

This is why I fundamentally dislike the zBlock model, because it is not such a bicameral system.

In this text I have outlined the concept in a very general way, but as I wrote at the beginning, we still have technical limitations related directly to the process of honest and importantly anonymous voting. And it remains to be seen how we can arrive at a fair model of governance.

Right now the market and current priorities did not allow us to approve Areta’s proposal, but I thought it was a very good idea to outsource the development of the Zcash governance model.

Thanks for this question!

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Thank you for your answer.

I appreciate you going into the details of how you see the current situation, it sounds to me like we are fundamentally aligned.

Now, if the proposal of @areta did not get approved and we have no-one taking the time to challenge the unilateral decisions of our three CEOs, how can any of this have any credibility to ZEC holders? A somewhat neutral third party clearing things up was literally a way to help diffuse a conflict that has been and can remain quite damaging to us. I personally cannot think of any higher priority in Zcash.

It’s literally what I suggest as well. The technical community would make a bi-yearly (for example; investors can’t review things all year long) proposal and the ZEC holders approve or refuse, with their decision being binding. I have even suggested we create some kind of “ZEC Unit 21000” group to facilitate coordination between ZEC holders.

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That’s a vivid proof that coin voting can actually hurt token holders:

Zcash is the only project in the entire crypto space whose issuance went through the market from day one.
Comparing it to centralized ICO tokens like Monaco (I am well acquainted with the history of the Crypto project) makes no sense.

But I agree that voting with coins, without considering the opinions of the expert community can lead to negative consequences.

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You would mind elaborating?

I’ll help. You don’t think such change could be pushed the exact same way the dev fund is being pushed?

That’s true but at least it wouldn’t hide behind a simulacrum of pseudo democracy.
The people have voted!!! when in fact only a handful of whales decide behind the curtain.

I literally proved you wrong and you just go on with more non-sense. Ok.

No, I will not. I’d rather call your bluff, go sell.

Ill still be here even if you tank it to $2.

Lets do this.

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Well, you’d be there, but there’d be no development. I guess the most private coin is the coin that no one uses. :sweat_smile:

They wont sell hanh, this is all bs. Prove me wrong Doze.

Actually how would they sell anyway? They do not KYC right? Unless they are part of a nation state with serious access.. makes you wonder.

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There are more sellers than buyers though as shown by the downward trend. I think zcash has a holier than thou attitude, and it may not end well. There are plenty of great ideas that never materialized, we are not immune.

Yes, but coming in trying to bully the forums and make idle threats is outrageous. If ONE person can actually kill a project, than guess what, this project has failed.

Go ahead Doze, break Zcash.

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I must have missed the part where they threatened to sell. Personally, I think the best (or the least terrible) outcome is the zcash research gets private funding. IMO, since Halo2/Orchard (nearly 3 years ago), there hasn’t been much going on that front.

If we do yet another round of sham poll, while the previous one was already known to be deeply flawed, it will sort of seal the deal for me in my belief that Monero will win the privacy token battle.

It’s much easier to copy a technology than a community with strong values.

For that reason, yes, I will need to sell part of my stash to readjust the balance of my bets. It’s not a threat, it’s a fact.

It’s mistake. I know that community from the inside. You will definitely not like it ))

No matter what the market conditions are right now, in the Zcash community, I feel that my money and I are safe. Monero can’t provide this. But I don’t want to get into the details.

From a financial standpoint, monero may be more stable at least for the time being. For privacy, it’s questionable.

If we focus on the price of XMR and ZEC, definitely yes. XMR - tail issue of 462 coins per day, maximally distributed among miners, although the lion’s share is on stolen capacity and still I assume that there are ASICs for monero, as it was before, just they do not advertise them. Plus they are already out of all the exchanges with available leverage, which greatly prevents any fluctuations. The dollar issue of Zcash and Monero is comparable, and until November 2024, the dollar issue of Zcash was higher throughout its existence. So which of these coins is more popular is still a big question.

Meanwhile, Zcash will never go below $20 for longer than one day. And that can only be with a cascade of liquidations due to excessive leverage. To be convinced of this, it is necessary to delve into the theory of pricing PoW coins and study the cost of production, as well as the motivation of miners. It is very likely that there is not enough corn on the planet to wait for ZEC to be at $16 once again. But that’s everyone’s business.

All in all, sli so to speak, Zcash has a much whiter and more decent background. And big money can be launched in monero, only if there is no antipathy to the activity of darknet, because the lion’s share of their community is focused on this kind of activity. Even knowing the stability of this coin, I personally want nothing to do with it. I’m just squeamish.

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I’m sorry but I have to completely disagree with any statement that puts a min (besides 0), or a max value to a cryptocurrency, whether POW, POS, or anything else.

Of course! Everyone has their own methods of analysis. I use them for my own purposes and do not recommend them to anyone. These are my tools.

And even below zero. As was the case with oil futures on March 13, 2020. The derivatives market is very strange in a way. I just know persistent people who mine them for themselves. And if the price is below the mining level, they buy coins on the market, but don’t stop mining. Yes, let’s say they don’t have all the money in the world, but for me it’s a benchmark and the pattern of behavior.

Just another thought. Zcash is a mansion in the world of the crypto. It’s not just an altcoin. For many people, this is the most reliable way to keep money away from prying eyes. There’s no way to change that. Even if the price goes to zero for a moment, none of them won’t run away. These are confident people who have money in other assets. They don’t rush around. They are not exchanged. You may not know anything about them, but they exist. And they have accumulation strategies. Everyone here can be confident in the future, do their job and have no doubts. We can and should accelerate the processes, but they are inevitable.

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