Is innosilicon a9 zmaster is a good investment?


#1

Im planning to get one. Im looking for a trusted website. Innosilicon.com legit site has some customers that didnt get the product ordering from innosilicon.com and worst is didnt get refund as well :frowning: anyone knows?


#2

Short answer: No.

Long answer: Buying an ASIC is never an “investment”, it’s pure speculation. You’re speculating that you can mine more ZEC than the cost of the miner, which is a mathematical impossibility unless the value of the underlying coin increases, mainly due to new batches of miners being released every few weeks. What happens is that the new miners cause the network hashrate and network difficulty to increase, which reduces your mining income proportionally. Your miner produces an income stream that decreases exponentially, and eventually produces no profit whatsoever.

It’s a much better idea to simply buy ZEC with the money you intended to use to purchase the ASIC, you’ll actually get more ZEC for your money that way.


#3

Tha’ts a distored way to put it and completly false.

Let’s look at it using MATH.
Innosilicon A9 costs 4000$ for European and 4500$ for US.

Eletricity cost for an a9 ranges from 45$ to 90$ a month (0.1 cts per KW to 0.2 cts per KW)

Let’s take worst case scenario: an american with 0.2 cts per KW.

In 2 years total cost of eletricity would be 2160$

Total investment would be of 6660 $ for a US citizen.

Buying ZEC with 6660$ right now would be 54.8 ZEC


With 50Ksol/s and 1000Mh/s total hashrate, daily return would be of 0.28 ZEC

In 2 years, if hashrate stays @ 1000 Mh/s, you would mine 204.4 ZEC.

That’s 4 times the amount you’d have if you’ve bought directly. And only focusing on worst case scenario and in only 2 years of mining (not 3,4 or 5).

To make an a9 unprofittable hashrate must go up more than 4 times and/or your machine should malfunction within 2 years (which is highly unlikely).

The real threat for these equihash ASIC: zcash decides to fork to another algoryhtm.

Innosilicon.com is the real deal, even if it doesn’t have https.
Make sure domain is correct, there are many fake copys.
If someone bought from innosilicon.com and got scammed it might be they’ve got their hosts file hacked…


#4

It’s not false. Your post is the one that’s misleading since there’s zero chance the network hashrate stays static. In fact, network hashrate doubled in the last 3 months and will likely continue to grow at a similar rate as long as ASIC manufacturers continue to sell new batches. I’m also using facts and math to achieve my projections, which I will clarify here and anyone can verify the accuracy of what I’m claiming.

Here’s a link to the daily average Zcash Network Difficulty: https://www.coinwarz.com/difficulty-charts/zcash-difficulty-chart

Here’s a link to a profitability calculator that allows you to factor in monthly difficulty grow: http://www.mycryptobuddy.com/ZCashMiningCalculator

To calculate the projected revenue of a one Innosilicon A9 use the above calculator and input a hashrate of 50000 Sol/s, yesterday’s average difficulty (18M), and a monthly difficulty growth rate of 25%, which is approximately the current rate the network hashrate is growing. You can also adjust the view to coins generated and time frame to 24 months.

The resulting projections are that you’ll mine 36 ZEC over 2 years. You can adjust the monthly difficulty growth rate up or down to see the variance in projections. Lowering the monthly growth rate to 20% would result in 44 ZEC and raising the monthly growth rate to 30% would result in 30.65 ZEC over the same 2 years.

Now let’s calculate what the total cost of an A9 is to see how much ZEC we could buy. The current price including a power supply and shipping to North America is $3834 USD. I live in Canada, so we pay 15% tax on imports, which brings the total up to $4409 USD. Your mileage may vary based on your local taxes, but if tariffs apply to US customers then this calculation would need to be adjusted accordingly. Now for electricity, let’s assume 13 cents USD per kilowatt hour and a continuous draw of 600W. You’ll be paying about $56 USD per month, so your electricity cost will be roughly $1344 over 2 years.

The total inclusive cost for purchasing the A9 and running it for 2 years is $5753. Right now you could purchase 46 ZEC with that, which is more than any of the projections we previously calculated. You would need to assume a monthly network hashrate growth of less than 20%, which is entirely unlikely in my opinion, but to clarify for all objective observers it is possible to make more ZEC if and only if the network hashrate grows slower than it’s current rate of growth. Do you think with all the new ASIC batches shipping this month it’s likely that the network hashrate growth will slow down or speed up?

Finally, there’s one major factor which I haven’t even included into the calculations. If you order an ASIC today you won’t actually see the numbers in the above projections since the network is growing every single day. Estimated shipping time is about 2-3 weeks, so you’ll actually start mining at a much higher network difficulty than yesterday’s average.


#5

Where are you seeing that people who ordered directly from Innosilicon didn’t receive their orders? I have seen several complaints from so called resell sights but nothing from anyone who directly purchased from their website.

Also why is your subject different from what you posted?


#6

I have to agree that hashrate will not be anywhere near the same even a month from now. I think it will be 2 Msol at the end of the year. Doubling time should take longer since the hashrate is higher unless they pump out even more ASIC’s per batch. I think it is a guarantee that it will be 4 Msol sometime next year, most likely by summer.


#7

You are assuming that hashrate will grow steady every month with more than 20%? With this market?
Personally I think it’s exagerated and that you’re looking at it pessimistically.

I’m not saying that you are wrong, but

Yes, I think hashrate will grow lesser in percentage a month than the last 2 months.
If hashrate grows steady I’d say it will only be supported by continuous price halving (on ASIC), which as a miner suits me fines.

4000 Msol/s with 50k Sol/s machines @ 800$? That sounds good to me.

We are not even sure that we will be able to mine with these machines in april 2019, if zcash announces a fork I wouldn’t see any sane miner buying these machines.

Also to put in to consideration are the other equihash minable coins. If zcash network hits 4000 M, then also other coins would have 700-800 M too.


#8

Me personally thinks that buying directly ZEC by now might be the better option indeed.

By now i’am pretty sure the asic flooding won’t stop, better units will be released and maybe other producers enter the equihash market as well. There is even another factor, if a coin/project still on asic friendly equihash decides to fork than this hashrate will again shifted towards the remaining asic friendly equihash coins, mostly ZEC.

From the first Batch Z9 mini until now we have a profitability drop. It’s now about 1/4 - 1/5 what it was, it’s as expected of course but still … huge. While i’am pretty sure the batch 1 and batch 2 units delivered until now will ROI, i wouldn’t take a bet if this applies as well to batch 3+ or other producers selling their units from now.

There are even more small factors that raise the price for the asic as you need a PSU, cables, router, internet connection, whatever, and of course time and hope it doesn’t broke for the whole time. Additionally there is a risk that there still can be a decision to fork by zcash bevor any ROI …

I personally bought 1 Mini from batch 1 and 3 from batch 2 and i wouldn’t risk any more after that.


#9

This doesn’t look like a sign that many are buying ASIC ATM.


#10

I’m assuming the current rate of growth will continue, as it shows no signs of slowing down and actually appears to be accelerating.

Manufacturers will sell as many units as they can at the current price point, but ultimately they’ll need to reduce prices to sell the next batch once current shipments drive up difficulty enough to make ROI clearly impossible at the old price point. You may be able to purchase an A9 for $1000 in the future, but what good is it if it still can’t ROI due to increased difficulty and lower ZEC prices?

That’s the game ASIC manufacturers play, always lowering prices to entice new buyers, but the income decreases too fast for your purchase to see any ROI unless the value of the underlying coin is also rising.

I don’t believe Zcash Co. will announce a fork to change the PoW algorithm at this point, because a large portion of the Zcash community has invested into ASICs. Forking would almost certainly result in a contentious fork since people are not going to allow their significant hardware investments to become bricks without a fight.

Rather, I expect a fork to come in late 2020 or 2021, perhaps with a switch to Proof of Stake that nobody is anticipating. I believe most mined ZEC is currently being accumulated by savvy miners who are expecting the shift to PoS, which would give current ZEC holders significant mining income once staking is fully implemented. Inflation will still be high after the first halving, so ZEC stakers will likely see double digit % returns.


#11

In my experience, the A9 Zmaster had and still has the best bang for the buck, it’s one of the best performing miners out there in terms of mining and acquisition price…BUT …the manufacturer, in this case Innosilicon has created a even more performant Equihash asic that they released in december 2018, and that is available now for ordering.
The new equihash miner, or the equihash master as they call it is called the Innosilicon A9+ Zmaster, and it’s basically 2X Innosilicon A9 in one but with more hashing power.
For example :
1x A9 zmaster = 50kh/s and 620w consumption
1x A9+ zmaster = 120+ KH/s and 1550w consumption, so you basically get 60kh/s for 775w … BUT it is said that the A9+ Zmaster can mine up to 150KH/s so in my opinion it’s a beast.

More details here: Innosilicon A9+ Zmaster


#12

Sure, from a technical point of view it’s a beast, at least for now, until the next upgrade or next generation equihash asic, no doubt here.

The problem is that more and more batches are released, prives are low and all over, like alwas, difficulty will raise and profitability will lower more and more. In my opinion and due my recent researches i come to the conclusion that whatever hardware is released for equihash it won’t ROI IF you don’t have access to cheap electricity, means below 9-10 cents or even lower per kw/h… Easy and simple as that…


#13

Yes Alex you are partially right. But in my opinion , power cost should never be more than 0.9c/kwh if you are serious at mining. And for the new batches i think we find ourselves in a positive situation as the manufactures don’t have large sums of cash laying around as they did in the beginning of 2018 and they can’t afford to produce very large batches if they do not sell. So i think investing in a A9+ for example is not bad, because for one we’ve had the experience of the previous model which was very good, two - we know that equihash coins don’t block or fork away that easily and three- well as i said , manufacturers can’t afford large batches right now.


#14

That’s up to everybodys discretion if he wants to invest or not. Just sharing some thoughts as a previous asic miner that stopped mining 3 weeks ago.

The batches might be not as big as for the X11, SHA256 and other algos, but than again, on equihash there is as well way less hashrate as on others and way less coins compared to scrypt, x11, sha256 and others.

There is no doubt that the current asics are still profitable for miners with electricity prices even over 20 cents (up to the asic), but this is changing due difficulty and price. The current calculation without even having shipped the A9+ shows that it would need about 400 days ROI at 13 cents kw/h (if i remember right from another topic about it some days ago and a roi calculation another user made!).

400 days ROI is equal to NEVER, easy and simple as that. Now 8-9 cent per electricity is pretty good for an average joe private miner, but is it good enough to compete with the mining farms with 2 cent electricity access? In the medium to long run it isn’t good enough in my opinion.

Nowadays i personally would just prefer buying ZEC, no more daily electricity costs, no more hardware and maintaining it, no more anything that wastes daily working hours or money. Just make a calculation how a direct buy is comparing to mining with your electricity costs. That’s how i would begin it to see how long i have to mine including electricity payments to get the same amount of ZEC buying today.

Just some thoughts that might help you safe some money :slight_smile:


#15

Of course if you compare mining to trading there is no comparison at the moment as the market is bearish , but i compared the A9+ with other miners available now, thats why i said that it’s a good miner, it is good compared to other mining machines


#16

As said, technically it’s a beast, absolutly agree with this, no doubt here. It’s the top notch asic for equihash here and now…