I don’t know how to remain optimistic after this vote. All these conferences, all these hours spent discussing Zcash, promises to followers - all of this has been undermined by one indicative vote. This entire forum has been devalued. I need time to gather my thoughts and at least comprehend what has happened. I no longer have any guarantee that in a year’s time, Tachyon or whatever else there will be won’t end up in the trash bin, just like ZSA, which will be deployed in Dash faster than in Zcash for money that, frankly, would be better off going to the miners.
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Or that members of ZCAP who do own ZEC chose not to participate in the coinholder vote as well. That could have been for any number of reasons, including that the current coinholder voting process requires moving your ZEC between mnemonic phrases to be secure, which is a non-trivial security problem for larger holders.
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its a landslide of immense proportion under 2% in favor. theres no way to spin it that ZSAS could have won under any circumstance but i agree that voting posed risk but i also find it disturbing that your telling me members of ZCAP werent able to safely vote but they are capable of running Zcash politics.
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Yes. We need to make it easier for broader participation, at haste.
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I understand you are disappointed. I didn’t want TEX addresses, but overwhelmingly lost that battle. We don’t all agree on all things. We must agree on the essentials.
Here’s the thing: https://x.com/jswihart/status/2025069583875391917?s=46&t=mNu7BQDUn3jehzQsyiHvYQ
As for me, I believe we have a small and ever-shrinking window to bring self sovereign money to the world at a scale, and to ensure Zcash is too big to be killed.
That requires skill, conviction, risk-tolerance and focus among the devs, those running infrastructure, and the coin holders. It’s the core of our mission that unifies and emboldens.
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I want to say for myself that I prioritize coin holders’ votes. That’s why I’m so upset. I don’t want to dispute this decison.
But at the same time, I feel that education is pointless in a situation where holders may not be interested in it. “Don’t touch my investment” - that’s how it looks.
This is exactly what you were talking about a two year ago when you wrote:
These are just new holders, it’s not even Wall Street money, but we’re already stuck. So yes, in my opinion, the window of opportunity has already closed. Well, if you think there’s a chance to implement something, that’s good. I’m not so sure about that anymore.
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Coinholders didn’t have the ability to express their views on some of these subjects before. We made these decisions for ourselves based on our own incestuous consensus-building exercises on this forum and a few other places. I would often hear, “That forum has so many negative people in it! There’s lots of Zcashers that don’t go there and I don’t think their voices are being heard. What about the coinholders?“
Well, here’s what it feels like to have that cold water thrown in your face. I’m very excited about this precisely because it is uncomfortable for some folks. This is (part of) how the project has dug itself out of a rut over the last year and a half.
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Glad someone else is calling this out.
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And my copy of the vote.db : here
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Looking at these results, the biggest takeaway for me is the clear difference in point of view between the Coinholders and the Forum/ZCAP.
It feels like we have a ‘silent majority’ of holders who aren’t active here. We should figure out how to onboard these voters and new users onto the forum so they can share their perspectives and engage in the debate directly, it would make our governance much more robust.
In any case, they are the users of the chain!
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using joshs words against him is stupid because your failing to realize the difference between stopping upgrades entirely and refusing to make Zcash private ethereum. Zcash holders arent against innovation they are against ZSAS
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also one thing i forgot to add was if Zcash holders are against innovation like you say then why was tachyon a unanimous approval. is tachyon not innovation??
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If only Josh could have said this back 2023, or even 2024. I can only speculate the WHY, but I’m sure it involves lawyers and money. Now I know why zcashd dep has dragged on this long.
Not a good look, and I’m a bit disappointed. I’ll get over it, but not before I express myself.
I guess we can call this new direction Zcash ( Josh cohort edition ) ? 
Really curious how ZF and other major orgs will balance this cluster.
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Two years ago, there was no disagreement about ZSA. None whatsoever. There was complete consensus that it was necessary, so millions of community funds were directed toward it. This is direct proof that any innovation can be stopped. There will always be someone bigger whale than you. Just wait.
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ZF never believed fully in Zcash as they had more than half the dev fund in bitcoin because they believed bitcoin was a better investment.
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That’s an outrageous statement. I Dont’ agree.
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What I was referring to was institutional interests and the funding of Bitcoin core. If you want to use my words, best to ensure you understand my meaning.
Bitcoin was captured because its design, which ensured Its destruction or capture from the outset.
This is not the same as polling different constituencies. It’s conflating different things.
I think it’s more productive to use your energy to convince those that disagree with your opinions using logic, facts and math.
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I’m afraid my fins are much too small to effect this ball. Spin all you want, this looks bad.
so something josh said 2 yrs ago matters now but ZF costing the foundation 10x returns because they chose bitcoin over zcash is ok to you? as far as i know josh and the former ecc team didnt do such antics they had most funds in zcash minus operating expenses
minty, good sir, this has been years in the making. I encourage you to read the forums, start with my history.
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