Announcing Ycash, The First "Friendly Fork" of the Zcash Blockchain

[boxalex]

Actually it’s not that easy and simple as you might think it is with trademarks, domains, similar. For sure a trademark like Zcash does not cover automaticlly everything that might as well contain zcash somehow.

Good example is: amazone versus amazon, both worldwide trademarks for long time used today. No bad faith on either business.

Same would go for zcash if there is for example another trademark for Bizcash, Zcashboxes, Clickzcash (Clickz is a trademark), and so on. Enough the business has indeed as well such trademark and the name is related to their business due a brand, whatever.

It’s most often if the consumer get’s fooled, misslead and so on. IF there is no bad intention, bad faith than it’s most likely NOT a trademark infrigement.

For example if i create another crypto coin naming it: Zcashier there is a good chance it’s an trademark infrigement as it will/could/should misslead consumers.

But if i create a Bank with Clickzcashbank it would not be a trademark infrigment.

I hope you get the idea. IF this would not be like that we would have only a handfull of trademarks as short words/letter combinations just get repeated in words soon or late. Leave alone common used words like cash, bank, invest and so on… The general rule bevor others apply should allways be “are consumers tricked/missleaded/fooled/confused” with a given trademark. IF the answer is NO than in most cases there is no chance it will have success as a trademark infrigment dispute. There are of course some expections.

[noobvie]

I suggest to use XCash, it sounds ‘mystery’

[sonya]

@anon75406386

I agree with you @sonya that there is a lot to gain with collaboration, but like @CitricAcid said, there is nothing atm. What do they have to offer to Zcash ?

From my perspective, the downsides of having Ycash discussion on this forum are negligible, while the upsides could be huge. At this stage we don’t know how the project will develop or who will gravitate toward it, and I don’t see a compelling reason to incur the opportunity cost of alienating potential future Ycash contributors.

So that’s the practical reason for my stance. But there’s also a values-based reason. Here are the top two values from the Zcash Foundation’s list:

• Transparency. We are committed to being accountable to the community. Our policies, significant decisions and their rationale, and software shall all be publicly visible. We will strive to accurately and accessibly communicate the security properties of Zcash and of proposed changes.
• Inclusivity. The Zcash ecosystem consists of many subcommunities, such as end-users, developers, miners, exchanges, traders and researchers, in many countries and cultures. They should all be given a voice within the Zcash community and the Foundation’s deliberations.

The Zcash Foundation does things in public whenever possible, and we welcome multiple demographics of all sorts. Our main focus is Zcash, but anything that seems likely to advance our mission is fair game, if it also seems like a high-ROI use of resources. (For example, we helped fund the Monero Konferenco.) That entails a general attitude of friendliness and openness.

Granted, the first guideline in the “Etiquette” section of the Community Guidelines explicitly asks users not to “[p]ost topics unrelated to Zcash.” But I would argue that Ycash is very related to Zcash, hence this rule doesn’t apply.

Personally, I would have no problem with people creating threads about Monero or Bitcoin on this forum. But I’d have to discuss that with the other moderators, since it’s not my decision to make unilaterally.

To be frank, and again only speaking for myself, I don’t care whether Zcash in particular succeeds or manages to gain widespread adoption. However, I deeply care that a currency with Zcash’s properties — both robust privacy and the other aspects inherited from Bitcoin — is available for people to use, and I would prefer for it to become the default. Zcash is the best prospect, and I don’t expect that to change anytime soon. The team(s) working on it are unparalleled, at least when it comes to zero-knowledge cryptography expertise.

But if another cryptocurrency came along that proved to be better than Zcash, or if Zcash changed in some especially disadvantageous way, I would shift my support to the new best option. My allegiance is not to Zcash — it’s to providing accessible tools that help people resist financial surveillance and censorship.

[boxalex]

Maybe my English is too weak to understand this correctly, but my impression is that some forum members seem to be more dedicated to Zcash than you are …

Again, in case i got this impression due my bad English knowledge, sorry, but that’s how this statement sounds to me…

@sonya

I don’t care whether Zcash in particular succeeds or manages to gain widespread adoption.

@sonya

I would shift my support to the new best option. My allegiance is not to Zcash

Edit due moderation request: Removed my personal opinion that if it was my company i wouldn’t be ok with such commitment.

[sonya]

For what it’s worth, I’ve told @acityinohio what I wrote above multiple times. I take integrity to my employer very seriously, not least because I deeply respect the leadership and the people I work with.

I don’t know whether I would quit the Zcash Foundation if I thought Zcash was no longer the best tool for what it does, because my choice would depend on various unknown factors, which at this point are purely hypothetical. The Zcash Foundation could easily still be doing work that I cared about and thought was valuable, even in the event that another cryptocurrency eclipsed Zcash.

Also, the bar for “not the best anymore” is high. For example, I strongly oppose timelocking miner rewards (personally), but if that went through it wouldn’t be enough to outweigh Zcash’s important and unique features.

As it stands, I love Zcash! There’s a lot of work to do, but it’s a great and innovative product. I’m excited about the work, because I think it will improve Zcash and strengthen its ecosystem. But I’m not gonna lie about my motivations or priorities for caring about Zcash in the first place.

Similarly, once I understood Zcash, I thought (and continue to think) that it’s better for comprehensive censorship-resistance than Bitcoin and Monero.

[boxalex]

Translated into my native language (german) “i don’t care” excludes absolutly “i love”, but that’s just my understanding of these 2 phrases.
However, i don’t want to re-rail the topic but me personally is still more than shocked. But honor for being that straight …

[sonya]

Oh interesting, in English “I don’t care” is a pretty flexible phrase. Also I think it’s important to note that I didn’t say that I don’t care about Zcash. Rather, I said that I don’t care whether Zcash in particular is the Zcash-like thing that wins or becomes most popular. Does that make sense?

[daira]

Please note that extended discussion of how committed any particular person is to Zcash is certainly off-topic, and suggesting that this would be a reason for them to be fired is a personal attack. Please cut it out @boxalex; you may consider this an official moderation warning.

[Dodger]

PSA: You can mute topics you’re not interested in as illustrated below.

[artkor]

how do You manage to move any topic into the discussion of GPU and POS every time?

Regarding Your reasoning, I would like to respond based on my experience. All this dry statistics at first glance may seem convincing, however …

I have three good GPU-farms and I mined Zcash even when it was not profitable for the majority. I even don’t know at what point it became unprofitable, simply because I didn’t sell a single coin.

Now I have an additional four A9. At the same time, I continue to mine any coins on GPU-farms, what I can sell on TradeOgre with a highest ROI. From there, I send bitcoin and buy Zcash every week.

Why did I write this? I agree that a number of active addresses is certainly an important parameter that makes it clear about the network. But we can’t know the goals and objectives of the owners of these addresses.

If the goal is just to sell - then I don’t see any value in this address for Zcash and I’m sure that this address-owner didn’t understand what Zcash is. He unfortunately didn’t realize a potential of the coin and a prospect of its use freedom, and used mining only to enrich. And I’m not sorry that such people left the community.

The lack of ASIC resistance doesn’t exclude the possibility of remain a Zcash supporter. From a technical point of view (with regard to network stability), I trust the decision of the professionals, and not the noise of those for whom some reason Zcash has become unprofitable.

I apologize for offtop.

About the fork. I respect everyone’s opinion and write frankly. I do not find in the new coin any value for myself. First of all, because I trust only one team of professionals and will follow only one project. I will exchange Ycash as soon as possible for Zcash.

I would not like to offend anyone with these words, but it’s true.

[hloo]

I think @artkor’s post is a great example of how one can express a critical opinion about Ycash without casting aspersions.

@artkor, if it maximizes your ability to acquire more ZEC (via exchanging YEC for ZEC), I invite you to consider mining Ycash with your GPU farms.

[artkor]

@hloo

I think @artkor’s post is a great example of how one can express a critical opinion about Ycash without casting aspersions.

@artkor, if it maximizes your ability to acquire more ZEC (via exchanging YEC for ZEC), I invite you to consider mining Ycash with your GPU farms.

I will keep it in mind. Thanks!

[hloo]

The Safe.Trade exchange has announced that they will list Ycash:

SafeCoin

[revo5]

What about Kraken? 20 char

[hloo]

We will apply to be listed on Kraken, but you should assume for the time being that they will not list Ycash.

[CitricAcid]

@sonya

Granted, the first guideline in the “Etiquette” section of the Community Guidelines explicitly asks users not to “[p]ost topics unrelated to Zcash.” But I would argue that Ycash is very related to Zcash, hence this rule doesn’t apply.

First I 100% agree that the original announcement and information about Ycash belonged in these forums, but after this amount of time IMO it does break with the community guidelines. Ycash has been announced, we have been made aware. Why is Ycash still using the Zcash forums for its own news and update repository. One final post should be allowed with a link to those forums before it is closed.

Either update the guidelines (like you recently did with NSFW) to exclude friendly forks or ignore the forums rules / Community Guidelines and continuity and consistency be damned

[hloo]

@CitricAcid

First I 100% agree that the original announcement and information about Ycash belonged in these forums, but after this amount of time IMO it does break with the community guidelines. Ycash has been announced, we have been made aware. Why is Ycash still using the Zcash forums for its own news and update repository. One final post should be allowed with a link to those forums before it is closed.

Either update the guidelines (like you recently did with NSFW) to exclude friendly forks or ignore the forums rules / Community Guidelines or continuity and consistency be damned

I fully intend to continue posting updates regarding Ycash to this thread. If you have a problem with that, you are welcome to mute this thread (as suggested above).

[CitricAcid]

@hloo

I fully intend to continue posting updates regarding Ycash to this thread. If you have a problem with that, you are welcome to mute this thread (as suggested above).

Just like I shared my opinion I want to thank you for sharing yours; however as it’s also stated above, and until there is a change in the community guidelines, this thread very much breaks those rules everytime you go beyond the original announcement.

I should not have to mute a topic on the Zcash forums that violates its own rules.

[addr]

I agree with @CitricAcid regarding the rules. It’s not really the place to make an entire dedicated (sub)forum for a fork of Zcash… Why don’t you use the BT thread instead?

Anyway, if you really intend to get some traction for your fork, you should at least

1. Get a website
2. Create a subreddit
3. Animate your BT thread.

Is any of this on the map? I mean, this is really the minimum in this space.

Maybe you should consider hiring someone for PR and marketing purposes, otherwise your fork will be stillborn.

Just sayin’…